On one hand, you seem to simply advocate increased giving by Christians. Sort of a “let’s do what we’re doing, but do it radically better.” I can certainly respect and agree with that.

On the other hand, there’s this talk of a different kind of economy or system. Capitalism is simply the economic system featuring private ownership of wealth and the means of producing wealth. The alternatives would be public or state ownership of capital. I’m actually not sure if there’s a practical difference between public and state ownership. I don’t think you’re advocating the latter. If there’s one thing that history shows us it is that everyone is better served if the ownership and control of wealth is kept at the lowest level possible (i.e. the individual family or citizen). You could also argue, as G.K. Chesterton did, that capital should be as widely distributed as possible within a capitalist system through various policy incentives (a system he called Distributism – ever heard of it?).

I think part of what bothered me about the initial post is that putting a limit on my living expenses and giving the rest away is still a me-focused system. I think what you seem to be advocating more in the second post is capitalism with an increased value on the sorts of true “service” industry jobs more commonly characterized as charities. It’s best, for the top-level system, to keep as much capital as possible in the hands of the private sector. Within that system, it would be best if every individual actor then properly valued the well-being of her fellow man and gave to insure it.

Ideas about doing that? Well, for starters we as a church could develop a more giving heart. It would go a long way if we just saw the need, as our society insulates well against other people’s problems. I think all the best ideas are unsexy ones about just reading the Bible and doing what it says. If you want to talk policy (the sexy stuff), I guess we could change the tax deduction for charitable giving into a tax credit. Better yet, let’s abolish welfare, social security, and foreign aid, and just say that the government will match every dollar given to a charitable organization with 1 dollar (or 2, or 10 – I’d have to do some research into the relative proportions). :)

And I agree with the need for production. But you have a blindspot.

Tangible goods are only one kind of goods produced. Especially in our economy, but also in economies past, the service sector also produces goods. There for-profit services, like consultants and the hospitality industry. But then there are not for-profit services, like teachers who inspire in the classroom, government officials who serve the public, social workers who look out for children without families, doctors who take care of the sick, ministers who love the broken, etc. They might not create tangible goods, but they all produce. And without them, our society would be in far worse shape.

So yes. I want people to produce. They are designed to work, as God told Adam in the garden. But what if it wasn’t merely for a profit motive? What if people gave into these non-profit service sectors so that people could produce “goods”? I think this kind of economy would supplement (but not replace) a market economy quite well.

What do you think?

I think there are two important factors that are missing from your picture of the economy. First, there’s the aspect of production. The farmer who plants seeds and reaps a hundredfold actually creates something from nothing (sun, soil, seed, water, and labor excepted). Perhaps more common in America, the scientist who discovers a superior material or process has also produced something from nothing (education, experimentation, and thought excepted). Even more than the physical harvest, the advancement of knowledge is production because it lasts forever and can be cheaply disseminated. Everyone knows this, but for some reason we forget it and start thinking of the world as a zero-sum game when it comes to politics. Second, there’s the aspect of lasting value. A road, school, or power grid can enrich far more lives than the life it took to build it. Likewise, educational, judicial, and economic systems are extraordinary infrastructures that give back far more than they take to establish and maintain.

These are important points for a few reasons. For one thing, we need an accurate picture of why America is wealthy and so much of the world is poor. Where there are unjust systems, they need to be rooted out. We should recognize, however, that a lot of what we have is due to the production and preservation that previous generations have given us. That shouldn’t make us feel like there’s no need to give to the rest of the world – love is our ultimate motivation anyway, not guilt. It should make us think about how we give and to whom.

Living at the median level and giving the rest away is an interesting idea. The devil’s advocate makes me ask – why the median? Jesus appeared to live well below the median. I don’t have his bank statements, but I suspect that Zaccheus was probably above the median even after he committed to justice and restitution. If you are living at the median, will it make you not put in that extra 5 hours to get the promotion? More to the point, will you not learn that extra skill or put that extra bit into the road, idea, or research you’re involved in? That’s the capitalist in me speaking, even though God knows I work for Him and not for the money. Choosing to live at the median puts the collective in control of my standard of living. If there is any sort of moral aspect to the decision of how much money to spend on myself, I am effectively surrendering the moral responsibility for that decision to the masses.

Perhaps I’m taking this all too seriously. Choosing to live at the median taps into one of the basic human beliefs – the belief that if most people can do it, then so can I. For those of us who just need a starting goal on our road to love, it provides one we can believe in.

Just finished your book and feel challenged to make 2009 the year we move our church into the fourth circle.

Please send me your contact info.

Gary